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04-24-2014, 07:16 AM #11
tengo Veteran
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Status: Offline Posts:431 Threads:31 Joined:Mar 2014
Dario Wrote:(otherwise it would just be a top players from the past 3-4 years list)

And this is the problem, because the only reason why it would be a "top players from the past" list is due to old players that have faulty logic. Old players that are too stuck in the past cannot fathom putting stronger-performing present day players in the top five, because they think it's still 2003.

The list of people you would take over Drue requires a map where back-peddling is rampant, close combat seldom occurs and spread shots are most important. However, these type of maps haven't dominated the playing scene in AC in at least two years so there's no basis for that excuse. What we've been playing in the past two years involve a lot of gap closing, objective-driven and ability to kill quick, something that Drue has been unrivaled in. Out of that list you've offered, PF would be the only one who has a good enough shot to compete in the open, close fights that are required. Time and time again, we've seen the others get outplayed.

Bone Wrote:Oh, and I was ranked #4 by someone. Been on armor critical for about a week or two now and barely play. That's what's up. Just kidding, it was prob inso.

Nah it was probably Dario, because you've played only a handful of games and apparently he knows you're top five right now. Dario had the worst list, but I'm sure a few others looked like his, because they forgot the date.

04-24-2014, 07:28 AM #12
Bone Still n00b
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Status: Offline Posts:238 Threads:37 Joined:Apr 2014
Actually I know what Dario put me as, and it wasn't him that listed me as 4th. Not that it matters. Only 4 people ranked me at all, hence not making the list even. I sure won't be losing sleep over that either. I barely play. Maybe again one day when I myself find the game competitive and interesting again. Besides, a lion doesn't concern himself with the opinions of sheep.
This post was last modified: 04-24-2014, 07:29 AM by Bone.

04-24-2014, 07:30 AM #13
Dario Still n00b
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Status: Offline Posts:134 Threads:4 Joined:Mar 2014
Are you talking about dogshit maps like hectic and stronghold? I'm referring to any decent quality map like BFD, Stank, Entice, smallflag, Joy, Kennedy, Crowded, Grinderv3, etc. They can still be small maps as long as they aren't gimmicky n00b maps. Nobody can "kill quickly" when you're talking about games filled exclusively with good players. In CTA, there's always plenty of dogshit players to pick off quickly, but in a league scenario that doesn't happen as often.

I also don't consider 3-4 years to be that long. If any of the inactive top players from that period still played, they would still be on top. It just so happens that Puffball, Sebek, Pman, and Astrok do still play and are still on top. I rated Bone #7 because if you give him a week or two to shake off rust, he would be right up there with the rest of these guys (and I might be selling him short). We are in the lowest point of ARC in terms of skill of the active player base in like 10 years.

Edit: I think the list of players I ranked ahead of Drue would be better than him in almost any map actually. These players have exhibited every skillset required to succeed on ARC for years (save for Yoshi but he honestly beats Drue at his own game). They aren't one-dimensional players like you could argue that some of the new age solid GO players like Fight3r and TerrOr are.

To further illustrate my point, I was at BEST a top 20 player in the past few years when all the good players still played (probably not even). Now I'm one of the best players when I play. I can promise you I didn't get any better; in fact, I'm pretty sure I'm worse now. However, in comparison to the active player base, I am now relatively better than I was a few years ago. Players like Fordus, Ominous, Techman, Dz would have no problem at all if they had a reason to play this game again. They were the best then and would still be the best (further knocking players like me, you, and Drue off the top of the mountain).
This post was last modified: 04-24-2014, 07:44 AM by Dario.

-love dar

04-24-2014, 10:22 AM #14
tengo Veteran
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Status: Offline Posts:431 Threads:31 Joined:Mar 2014
I'm talking about any map. I'm talking about BFD, Stank, Entice, Joy, any map. Drue has shown to be the better player in any situation where backpeddling, spreads and close combat is generally avoided. All the good players know anything can happen when the gap is closed and ideally you want to to make sure their health is lower when it gets to that situation. The point is, Drue has shown to be consistent with that, it's not based on the dogshit players, he does it against everyone. The evidence outweighs your claim (which is based solely on "I know this player would be better if he were active...")

How far do you want to look back? Because Glad 2012, TCH won the title after Drue joined them. They never lost a game in the playoffs, yet earlier during the season while Drue was on another team (CC), they won their series 2-1 against TCH. As a reminder, TCH was composed of CaDF plus some. The funny part is, even though it is obvious Drue had the largest impact in allowing TCH to grab the title, he was overlooked by other players such as Monoxide, Phusion and K0r. Those overlooking Drue's contribution were the same ones with the faulty logic, still stuck in the past, believing that regardless of the outcome, the best players in 2003 are still the best players today.

Yoshi is solid, but you are shining his knob too much, he's not beating Drue at his own game.

Also saying that Puffball is a top player... based on what? Puffball experiences the same problems and has the same successes that the majority of first picks have in CTA. If you are stuck with a bad apple, then you will generally suffer and lose. If the other team has to deal with that, you can have an amazing game with plenty of freedom. Drue has the largest impact out of any player in CTA and this is well-known. Nobody is picked before him. So where is Puffball a top player? He hasn't participated in Glad 2012, was not part of ACHT, so are you talking about SGL2012? If so, that makes your argument even weaker.

Drue has been playing this game just as long as us, and WITHOUT the support of top-tier GO players, he has done relatively well. You can't say with certainty that other players are better just because they were part of the most title-holding clan YEARS ago. If you switch Drue with any of those players and put him in a good line, he will do just as well or better.

Dario Wrote:They were the best then and would still be the best (further knocking players like me, you, and Drue off the top of the mountain).

Maybe with your faulty logic, but it hasn't happened on the playing field for at least two years! :>

04-24-2014, 12:38 PM #15
Turbo AC Administrator
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Status: Offline Posts:338 Threads:86 Joined:Mar 2014
Drue is the best CTA player ever. Puffball is a close 2nd.

Put Drue in a larger map, like Go (doesn't have to be Go), he has a much smaller impact. Now since we're talking about overall skill, I'll take Puff over Drue since Puff can accomplish more than Drue in different types of maps.

Spark Administrator
Founder of CTA and Gladiators

04-24-2014, 12:43 PM #16
eekum Veteran
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Status: Offline Posts:399 Threads:51 Joined:Mar 2014
Yoshi is the best CTA player ever.

FACT.

04-24-2014, 12:50 PM #17
CloudS Still n00b
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Status: Offline Posts:111 Threads:4 Joined:Apr 2014
Excuse me, imma let y'all finish but.....






Astrok is one of the greatest players of all time!.....OF ALL TIME! #GOAT

{ReignSupreme} | TCH - 2012 GWC Champion | odas. | New eRa Gaming

04-24-2014, 12:52 PM #18
Yosh Unregistered
 
(04-24-2014, 12:50 PM)CloudS Wrote:  Excuse me, imma let y'all finish but.....






Astrok is one of the greatest players of all time!.....OF ALL TIME! #GOAT

We found who put Astrok #1.

04-25-2014, 01:19 AM #19
Dario Still n00b
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Status: Offline Posts:134 Threads:4 Joined:Mar 2014
(04-24-2014, 10:22 AM)tengo Wrote:  Drue has shown to be the better player in any situation where backpeddling, spreads and close combat is generally avoided. All the good players know anything can happen when the gap is closed and ideally you want to to make sure their health is lower when it gets to that situation. The point is, Drue has shown to be consistent with that, it's not based on the dogshit players, he does it against everyone. The evidence outweighs your claim (which is based solely on "I know this player would be better if he were active...")

You keep referencing this evidence where "Drue has shown to be the better player" yet discounting my claims that he's nothing special in comparison to other good players. What evidence are you referring to that disputes anything I'm saying?


(04-24-2014, 10:22 AM)tengo Wrote:  Because Glad 2012, TCH won the title after Drue joined them. They never lost a game in the playoffs, yet earlier during the season while Drue was on another team (CC), they won their series 2-1 against TCH.

I mean yeah it helped to have Drue, but it's not like he was their best player after he joined. Monoxide and Dzaaneez were the two best players in that league. Adding Drue definitely helped solidify their starting 4 though and even gave them the depth to rotate players in and out throughout the playoffs. I'm not saying they would have won without Drue, but if they added Drue and dropped Monoxide they most definitely would not have won.


(04-24-2014, 10:22 AM)tengo Wrote:  Also saying that Puffball is a top player... based on what?

The skillset he has shown consistently since like 2009.


(04-24-2014, 10:22 AM)tengo Wrote:  
Dario Wrote:They were the best then and would still be the best (further knocking players like me, you, and Drue off the top of the mountain).

Maybe with your faulty logic, but it hasn't happened on the playing field for at least two years! :>

Yes it has. See Sebek.

-love dar

04-25-2014, 02:36 AM #20
Yosh Unregistered
 
I was one of the people who submitted a list and my list looked sort of the same as the final one (I didn't have myself in the top 5) but I would like to make a few comments on each position.

1. Sebek
I think this is fair enough. I really thought the first two players were both deserving of the number one spot and they both have great play styles and help their teams win.

2. Tobiashi
Same thing I said with Sebek. I do feel like Tobias is more trolly in CTA games, but he's a great fragger and has good game sense. Definitely deserving.

3. Parrotman
This was my first real shock. I put Parrotman #4 on my list but I did not expect the other lists to agree with that. I don't feel like Parrotman is a dominating force in any game mode but he is overall a great player. He has every quality that you want in a player.

4. Drue
Quite possibly the greatest CTA player of all-time, and I feel like just because of that he deserves to be close to the top of this list. Drue was a pretty decent GO player back in AoA before CTA was even created so I feel like if push came to shove he could definitely hold his own in there. Is he as good in GO as in CTA? Probably not, but only because he's so crafty in the CTA environment. He deserves such a high ranking.

5. Yoshi
Not going to comment on myself, but thanks for everyone who put me so high. Also, I hate you Berserk for not even including me on yours.

6. Akma
I think akma is a good player, but I personally did not have him this high. I don't really know how good he is in a go type map, but he is good in CTAs. He can carry a team at times.

7. Astrok
Astrok goes away and then he comes back and he's always extremely solid. He's good in both CTA and in GO so I feel like a high spot was deserved.

8. Tengo
A good player who is a top pick in CTA but can also carry his load in GO. I feel like a top ten spot is definitely worthy for tengo.

9. Unreal
Unreal has been deemed the best player on the game and while I wouldn't go that far he has certainly impressed me lately. The thing about Unreal is that he's a player who doesn't really specialize in a certain map type. He's good in all of them. I might have put Unreal slightly higher.

10. Dario
Dario is an exceptional player when he tries. He's an extremely skilled fragger with a great strategic mind and can carry a team in GO or CTA. I think the reason he is so low is because he has a reputation of a troll recently. When Dario tries he deserves to be higher in my opinion.

11. Genocide
One of the few that confused me. I didn't even have Geno on my list. The reason behind that is not because I don't feel like Geno is a premier player but because I feel like he has gone full troll mode. He's a great GO player, but he's meh in CTAs. Maybe a little too high.

12. Riptide
Great GO and CTA player. I really don't know why he's not a really highly regarded player because I think he's very good.

13. Benevolence
I think Bene is a good player, and his lag can be a nightmare for some people to deal with. Bene can carry his own in CTAs and sometimes a team. I haven't seen him in a GO setting to really know if he's well rounded but he's deserving of this spot.

14. RiddeN
I think this is about the perfect spot for ridden. When RiddeN tries he can surprise you with good 1v1 skills, and he has been around forever so he has a pretty good game sense.

15. CloudS
Well deserving. I feel like CloudS still has a lot of potential left to unlock. He's a constant force in CTA, but I feel like sometimes his GO aren't comparable. This is only because CTA has been THE driving force on ARC since he has been active. I'm not saying he's bad in GO because he's not, but he's definitely more suited towards CTA where he can dominate.

16. Bigdaddy
I really don't know about this. I didn't have him on my list. Not because he's not skilled but because he only has very brief spurts of activity. If he's active he deserves a spot in the top 20.

17. Phot0n
Phot0n is a good player and has two distinct styles depending on the type of map he's playing. I have noticed he can be quite aggressive in CTA but then be the exact opposite in GO maps. He's a skilled fragger and has been around the block. Well deserving.

18. Loki
I really don't know that much about Loki, but he's pretty good in CTAs.

19. Ecto
I think Ecto might be a little too underrated by the community. I can easily place him a few spots higher just because of his understanding of different maps. He's had a lot of GO experience in leagues in the past so if he put in the effort he could probably be good in that map again. In CTAs, he has shown to have good strategy in different maps and knows how to win. Underrated imo.

20. Dip
I think this is a good spot for dip. He never does anything stupid in maps, and will occasionally make a crazy play that will make you get hype. Plus, that lag can confuse a lot of lesser skilled players.

21. Insomniac
It depends on his state of mind. If he's intoxicated he could be placed a lot lower. If he's in a focused state then he could be placed higher. He's just an enigma.
This post was last modified: 04-25-2014, 02:37 AM by Yosh.






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