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ACG 2014 - Cash Tournament - Sets off!
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10-27-2014, 07:17 AM #21
Odoacer AC Operations Team
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Status: Offline Posts:154 Threads:16 Joined:Apr 2014
A couple of players have mentioned that they will return any of their winnings back to the pool. I see no problem with that. If you think the money should be used for something else, then fight for it. Also, come up with the "something else" part. Thanks.

10-27-2014, 07:39 AM #22
Bone Still n00b
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Status: Offline Posts:238 Threads:37 Joined:Apr 2014
People should be focusing more on what Dario is speaking of anyways: how to make this league successful. Money will bring the teams in. How do you work around scheduling though? What's going to keep the teams around that start losing a lot? Those are the major issues all recent leagues have had. Doing things the same way and expecting the same issues to not happen is a recipe for disaster, money or no money involved.

It should go without being said, but Lunu's suggestions are not the answer to any of these issues.

10-27-2014, 08:25 AM #23
DarkEvil AC Guide
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Status: Offline Posts:288 Threads:52 Joined:Apr 2014
Bone, obviously I am no pro at running a league. Dario also makes a very good point.... so if any of you have ANY suggestions, I would greatly appreciate them. I haven't written the rules yet, so I would like to see things from other peoples perspectives in order to achieve the maximum success we can throughout the tournament.

My idea for rescheduling was going basically.... if a team can't make it during a weekend, they have until a week after of the previous scheduled date to reschedule. This means teams can re-schedule during the week. If the rescheduling fails, then the league we schedule it for them. For finals or semi-finals, it could be more flexed and possibly let the teams decide on the date.

Something I was thinking, is that players would get an icon if they didn't win anything through the prize pool. The icon wouldn't be able for purchase and no one would be able to get it after that... so it would be exclusive. I know it's not much but it's better than nothing. I would like some help on some ideas of how to keep teams around that are losing.

10-27-2014, 10:01 AM #24
Lightning n00b
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Status: Offline Posts:88 Threads:7 Joined:Jun 2014
Bone. All your doing is taking suggestions and showing how they are flawed. Please come up with a suggestion to help. Why would anyone want to give suggestions when people like you are posting in these forums.

Another suggestion to keep activity throughout the year.

Instead of having an 1800 1 tournament prize pool.

Create 6 tournaments 2 months each -

and set aside 300 per tournament .. instead of everyone getting paid out maybe top 3 teams only.. 200 75 25 .. something like that

If we can integrate into CTA a league portion where we can play matches and report replays as if they were CTA games, which tracked each team person 2 month season.

Instead of creating a round robin tournament schedule create a system where anyone can create teams within the SITE DATABASE and challenge anyone else within that 2 month season, top 4 teams in the last week play for 1st 2nd 3rd positions. Then next season starts.
This post was last modified: 10-27-2014, 10:16 AM by Lightning.

10-27-2014, 10:44 AM #25
Turbo AC Administrator
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Status: Offline Posts:338 Threads:86 Joined:Mar 2014
I was going to post and bash some individuals, but all I will say is that if you're not on the same side with Odoacer when it comes to best intentions for this game, then you're pretty much clueless. I will back whatever decision Odoacer comes up with. His understanding of what needs to be done far exceeds anybody in this game.

By the way, I initially started the donations from way back in Spark, and I told the entire community that the $ would be recycled back to the community through leagues and tournaments. The actual donations from players this year was less than 20% of the total amount being used for the tournament. Whoever is saying all the $ was only to be used for dev, is 100% wrong.

Spark Administrator
Founder of CTA and Gladiators

10-27-2014, 10:55 AM #26
InSoMnIaC Still n00b
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Status: Offline Posts:125 Threads:22 Joined:Apr 2014
seperate the bottom half of the winnings for a lower tier of players maybe, or alternate the winnings for each set of tiers with a final showdown for the winners of the two tier groups. Having won a final prize in their tier they can be happy and still play in the "jv vs varsity game" The losers of that game will also receive some kind of "i was in the championship icon"

Also there should definitely be an option for A early weekend games or B late night weekend games. I too have a random schedule throughout the weekends and typically every other weekend i'm stuck at work all damn day thursday thru sunday

10-27-2014, 01:47 PM #27
Venture n00b
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Status: Offline Posts:58 Threads:11 Joined:Apr 2014
I would like to see a draft system in place, and find a way that lower ranked players get to play, maybe only have 4 teams, and we can play some larger maps. Maybe there is a way the rating system could be involved.

10-28-2014, 03:19 AM #28
Bone Still n00b
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Status: Offline Posts:238 Threads:37 Joined:Apr 2014
(10-27-2014, 10:01 AM)Lightning Wrote:  Bone. All your doing is taking suggestions and showing how they are flawed. Please come up with a suggestion to help. Why would anyone want to give suggestions when people like you are posting in these forums.

I highly doubt anyone is refraining from suggesting anything because the big bad Bone might critique their thought process. Please explain to me also how pointing out major flaws is a bad thing? Better yet, don't. You never make a single bit of sense in anything you post and you'll end up arguing about global warming or something knowing how far off topic and pointless your posts tend to get.

ANYWAYS... Scheduling. We're all accustomed to leagues being run on weekends. That's how it was done for years. The general consensus is that doing it that way isn't ideal anymore, for obvious reasons. We don't simply go to school anymore Monday through Friday and play ARC all weekend long. We work, we do other activities, etc. The LOGICAL (but unrealistic) solution is open scheduling. Allowing teams to determine their availability and scheduling games themselves with each other makes perfect sense. However, we've aged, but we haven't matured. What we get doing it that way is a whole slew of new problems. Teams wait til the last second to schedule, teams bicker with each other as if their times are the only ones that should matter, and teams purposely make things difficult for other teams (i.e. BPT). So that's out the window too. So I think the best bet is some sort of combination of the two. Scheduling based on teams availability, but actual game times designated by the league. What I mean is this, and keep in mind, this would take an extremely active person(s) to achieve this type of scheduling on a weekly basis.

Darkevil goes to PV and gets some sort of availability time frame from them for that week. That doesn't mean 10pm on Tuesday and THAT'S IT. Like 7pm to 11pm Monday, Tuesday Wednesday and 2pm to 6pm and 9pm to 12am every other day. Something to really work with. Then Darkevil goes to MS and does the same. DARKEVIL DOES NOT DISCUSS WITH EITHER CLAN THE OTHER CLANS AVAILABILITY. Once reasonable availability is determined for both sides, then Darkevil designates a time both clans are available. That's the best way I think anyways. It's not as if there are 100 different ways to do scheduling. This way surely isn't flawless by any means either. You still have the potential problems:

1) Teams are unrealistic with their activity level and don't offer much availability (shouldn't be playing but they'll sign up anyways)

2) Like I said, a VERY active member of the league will have to do this for each game, each week. Very time consuming.

3) The teams themselves have to be active so a league member can even discuss available times with them.

4) As weeks progress, schedules may vary slightly, but a teams overall availability will likely be similar week to week. Douchebag teams will realize when they're opponents can play the longer the league goes on and potentially just offer up non-matching times.

5) Teams usually prefer to play their very best line as is. Now money is involved, they'll want to do so even more. Another reasons teams will be stubborn regarding times they're available.

So I guess that's one way to consider doing it if you have the means. You definitely could make it more simple and clear cut as Darkevil suggested. Something a lot easier on the league. Designate a time, and if the two teams want to they can reschedule. That has problems like any other way of doing it though. The two teams might not agree on a reschedule time and the league has to step in anyways. Maybe the team that can make the original time refuses to reschedule (there is money involved remember?). Then you have forfeits. I certainly don't envy anyone who is dealing with scheduling regardless how it is going to be handled this league lol. Teams are super annoying in meaningless leagues already when it comes to scheduling games. Throw some money in the mix now, and the scheduling may very well be more entertaining than the actual games.

The other major issue is maintaining interest and activity the length of the league. It's easy the first week or two. Once teams start losing and know they have no chance, then they stop caring and stop showing up. I've never quite understood the thought process on this, though. You should have known before the first couple weeks you were going to lose, but whatever.

So one way to combat this: multiple achievements and rewards. When the only reward is for the team winning, it doesn't offer the rest of the teams anything. Now I know the prize pool for this has been split up so all teams get something, but I don't think it will matter. The top half will stay relatively active because they'll all have some sort of chance at winning or placing high (higher reward). The teams at the bottom though.. $30 bucks for the bottom team? That's $10 a person, if the team only has 3 players to split it amongst. That's not going to keep the team active through the whole season if they're getting demolished every week, which is highly likely. So every team needs a chance at SOMETHING. Winning it all isn't it, only a few teams have a chance at that. So heres a few suggestions, but there's likely way more:

1) Icons - Darkevil already mentioned this to some extent. Offering exclusive icons that aren't available to anyone else, nor will they be after this league. Personally, I don't care about icons and this wouldn't keep me playing throughout the season.. but some do like icons I guess so why the hell not offer them up. They do have to be unique though. It shouldn't be something I can get a day after the league is over for no real good reason.

2) Prize Pool - Consider splitting the prize pool differently, instead of just x amount of dollars to wherever the teams place at the end. This might not necessarily make a huge difference depending how you do it, but it can make the biggest difference if done right. For example, say you only use $1000 for the actual team standings at the end of the league. The other $800 is used for other achievements.

- Perhaps the league MVP gets $50 (very well might be the best player on the best team at the end, but this isn't always the case)

- Various stats can be used like MVP. Most damage dealt in the season gets $20 (achievable by any player regardless team really. ReV could get this, or just give it to Lugz right now. MOST DD). Most flags gets $20, etc. etc.

- MOST GAMES PLAYED. Now this very well could be a tie for a lot of players if they're fairly active. So instead of just rewarding the player at the end of the league with the most games played, maybe you do a drawing? Each game played is considered a "ticket" in the drawing pool. The more games you played, the more tickets you have, thus the better your odds of winning the drawing. The winner of the drawing can get like $100 or something.

- You can use drawings for anything league related even. Maybe have a weekly drawing for anyone who played a league game that week. $10 each week. Players can win multiple times or not, whatever league decides.

There is so many ways the money can be utilized to help maintain the interest throughout. All the dollar values I used above were just examples as well. It obviously can be split up however the league sees fit.

P.S. - SERIOUSLY consider throttling back CTA while you run this league. I know the CTA junkies think CTA is just the saving grace of ARC (don't even get me started), but do you or do you not want the league to be successful? I'm not saying stop CTA completely, but people that are on ARC play for whatever reason still. They play CTA because it's convenient. They can come and go whenever, because limitless CTA's will run each and every day. Make this league the main playing option while it is running, NOT CTA. Don't compete with yourself.
This post was last modified: 10-28-2014, 04:15 AM by Bone.

10-28-2014, 07:06 AM #29
cyro Forum Administrator
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Status: Offline Posts:742 Threads:153 Joined:Jan 1970
(10-27-2014, 10:44 AM)Turbo Wrote:  I was going to post and bash some individuals, but all I will say is that if you're not on the same side with Odoacer when it comes to best intentions for this game, then you're pretty much clueless. I will back whatever decision Odoacer comes up with. His understanding of what needs to be done far exceeds anybody in this game.

By the way, I initially started the donations from way back in Spark, and I told the entire community that the $ would be recycled back to the community through leagues and tournaments. The actual donations from players this year was less than 20% of the total amount being used for the tournament. Whoever is saying all the $ was only to be used for dev, is 100% wrong.

The information on the donation writeup by rareops was incorrect then, and I believe that is where this was brought up by myself & others.

tocs.

10-29-2014, 09:38 AM #30
RoboTech Veteran
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Status: Offline Posts:306 Threads:57 Joined:Mar 2014
I mean. Top 8 teams get something. That's pretty cool. I hope most clans try to make 2 teams, and we get some random ones too. Players coming back for it can go feck themselves tho.

If our lives were great we wouldn't need second ones on this hell hole.
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